Recognition

Being recognized as the #1 choice for Sensitive Skin alongside so many great brands is truly an honor.

A huge thank-you to the Byrdie team and all the testers for recommending our All-In-One Wax Kit.

Your thoughtful review means the world to us. 🧡

Read More

If you’re curious why Byrdie’s experts recommend Jelly Wax for a gentle, irritation-free waxing experience, check out the full article by clicking here.

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What I did next—stepping away from my business completely for nearly two years—felt like failure at the time. In retrospect, it was the most important business decision I’ve ever made.

The Breaking Point and the Pause

The success of Jelly Wax was overwhelming. I was trying to do everything myself—marketing, fulfillment, customer service.

Though I had two people helping with customer service, that was it. I had hired some consultants, but unfortunately, they weren’t a good fit for me at that point in my life.

By the end of the second year, despite impressive sales, I was completely burned out. I had made poor investment decisions and faced financial difficulties that my family had to help resolve.

I realized I was way over my head and didn’t know what I was doing. I made the difficult decision to pause the business completely, move to Austin, Texas, and take time to heal and reflect.

The Healing Process

During my break from Jelly Wax, which lasted nearly two years, I focused on personal growth and healing. This period was crucial for my eventual comeback.

I wasn’t just resting—I was learning how to take care of myself and be in my own skin without feeling like I needed to accomplish a number or reach a certain revenue goal.

When I first started Jelly Wax, it was largely about validation—a way for me to receive love, admiration, and recognition.

I needed a lot of love and self-affirmation. The break gave me space to reexamine these motivations and develop healthier relationships with both myself and my business.

A Partnership That Changed Everything

During this time, I met my partner, who completely changed my perspective. He was the first truly stable, calm, and kind person I had met in a long time. He gave me the space I needed to heal and to understand what I wanted to do with my life and business.

He saw what I had accomplished with Jelly Wax and encouraged me to return to it, believing in me when I had lost faith in myself.

As a professional chef, he understood that food is healing and cooked meals specifically designed to help balance my hormones and improve my physical health. Through healing my body, I was able to heal my mind as well.

A Fresh Start with Support

After about a year of recovery, I felt ready to consider returning to business. My partner took savings he had accumulated and invested in me and Jelly Wax, becoming a business partner as well as a life partner.

This trust was transformative—it showed me that trusting the right people can be incredibly rewarding. His investment provided the financial foundation needed to restart the business properly.

The Challenge of Multiple Businesses

During my break from Jelly Wax, I also launched Project Pollywog—a brand selling frog-themed jewelry with a portion of profits supporting frog conservation.

This passion project reconnected me with my love of animals and jewelry design, taking me back to my roots with Hannah Must House.

Project Pollywog grew quickly, reaching six figures within the first six months. However, as both businesses expanded, I faced a difficult truth: I couldn’t effectively run both simultaneously.

The creative demands, operational complexities, and divided focus stretched me too thin.

Despite Project Pollywog’s alignment with my personal interests, I made the difficult decision to pause it and focus entirely on rebuilding Jelly Wax.

Lessons in Focus and Self-Care

This experience taught me several valuable lessons:

1. Focus is a superpower, not a limitation. By concentrating my energy on one business, I could give it the attention it deserved. Problems that seemed impossible with divided attention became solvable when given proper focus.
2. Self-care is a business necessity, not a luxury. Burnout isn’t just personally devastating—it can destroy your business. Taking time to heal was ultimately the most strategic business decision I could have made.
3. The right partnerships make all the difference. My partner’s support—both emotional and financial—made rebuilding possible. Having someone I could trust completely transformed my business trajectory.
4. Sequential growth beats simultaneous expansion. I’ve learned that building businesses one at a time, rather than simultaneously, is generally the wiser path. This isn’t about abandoning dreams but recognizing that some goals are best pursued in sequence.

Conclusion

The Jelly Wax I rebuilt after my break was fundamentally different from its first iteration. With clearer values, better systems, and the right support, the business became more sustainable and purpose-driven.

Rather than just selling waxing products, we’ve developed a platform for addressing larger issues around body image and self-acceptance.

My journey from burnout to breakthrough wasn’t straightforward, but it was necessary. Sometimes the most challenging decisions—like stepping away completely or pausing a successful business—are exactly what’s needed for long-term success.

By prioritizing healing, focus, and the right partnerships, I transformed not just my business but my entire approach to entrepreneurship.

The path required patience and difficult choices, but these deliberate steps ultimately created a more sustainable foundation for growth.

My journey from burnout to breakthrough wasn’t straightforward, but it was necessary. Sometimes the most challenging decisions—like stepping away completely or pausing a successful business—are exactly what’s needed for long-term success.

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Our success on the platform didn’t happen by accident—it came from a deliberate strategy that I’ve refined through trial and error over time.

Here’s how I built our TikTok presence and how you might apply similar principles to your business.

The Power of Authenticity

To stand out on TikTok, you have to be unapologetically yourself. This is what I love about the platform—it rewards authenticity.

With Jelly Wax, even though I script my videos and write them ahead of time, I approach them as just an outline. When I’m actually filming, I add whatever feels right in the moment, making the content genuinely authentic.

Being authentic on TikTok isn’t just about being casual—it’s about staying true to yourself and your values. I share my perspective on body hair and related issues in a way that’s personal and honest.

Here is a link to one of Jelly Wax’s videos on TikTok responding to a consumers comment.

@jellywax Replying to @rottenbutch I couldn’t agree more! When i started waxing i honestly found so much more confidence with my body hair. I just prefer the look of not having any! In this vid i explain more about why. 🙂 #jellywax #waxing #hairremoval #tiktokshop #smallbiz ♬ original sound – Jelly Wax

Waxing is about choice and confidence

Research and Understanding the Platform

Success on TikTok requires a mixture of intuition and research. Building that intuition means actively using TikTok and studying the platform. You need to understand current trends, conversational styles, video pacing, and effective hook techniques.

While trends can drive views, I don’t rely on them heavily for Jelly Wax. I’ve intentionally avoided jumping on trends because my primary goal is to share our authentic message.

By mastering the platform’s mechanics while maintaining your unique voice, you create content that both performs well and genuinely represents your brand.

Know Your Message and Your Audience

Knowing who you’re talking to and what you want to say forms the foundation of effective TikTok content. When creating videos, I imagine I’m having a conversation with a friend.

I often start with a question or comment—not necessarily one directed at me, but something I might discover while researching brands similar to mine.

I ask myself: Am I trying to talk to my younger self? My older self? Who exactly am I addressing? This clarity helps me create content that resonates deeply with viewers.

Here is another video from Jellywax’s Channel about PCOS and waxing.

@jellywax Replying to @zai If you have PCOS, Jelly Wax might be perfect for you! Ive received a lot of feedback from people who have PCOS. The most common comment i see is that jelly wax helps them stay hair free for 1-2 weeks compared to shaving which lasts 1-2 days. If you’d like i can tag you in the comment threads for PCOS! #pcos #hairremoval #jellywax #pcostips #firstimewax #smallbusiness #waxing ♬ original sound – Jelly Wax

PCOS and waxing

My Content Creation Process

I’ve developed a specific approach to creating TikTok content:

1. I record myself talking as if I’m having a conversation with a friend, often starting with a question or comment.
2. I do a “brain dump” of thoughts on the topic, speaking naturally into my phone.
3. I use a transcribing app to convert this recording to text.
4. I edit and refine the transcription, organizing it according to my TikTok format while preserving the natural, conversational tone.
5. When filming, I follow this script but allow myself to add spontaneous thoughts or reactions that feel authentic in the moment.

This process gives me the structure of preparation without losing the authenticity that makes TikTok content so effective.

Embracing the Copy-Cats

I strongly believe in not caring about people copying my approach. I truly think that copying is the biggest compliment, and no one can copy you if you’re being authentic.

They might create a paper copy of your content, but they’ll never have your energy or your passion.

This is another reason why knowing your values and being passionate about your business is so important—those elements are uniquely yours and impossible to duplicate effectively.

When you’re truly passionate about something, that passion translates through your content in a way that simply can’t be replicated.

Conclusion

Building a TikTok presence with millions of views doesn’t happen overnight. It comes from consistently showing up, providing value, and staying true to your message—even when initial results aren’t immediately impressive.

By focusing on authenticity, understanding the platform, knowing your audience, and developing a sustainable content creation process, you can build a TikTok presence that not only drives views but also converts viewers to loyal customers and creates meaningful business growth.

Follow me on LinkedIn or Patron View for more.

Through both the successes and setbacks, I’ve learned critical lessons about what it truly takes to build a sustainable business.

Here are the three most important business lessons I’ve learned along the way.

Master Your Finances

The first and most important lesson I’ve learned is to understand your finances thoroughly. Talk to a CPA, become best friends with your CPA and tax accountant, and understand how money works.

Understand cash flow, learn how to do your books, track everything—track your expenses, track your income, and keep your bank accounts separate.

You don’t need to be an expert accountant by any means, but understanding how money flows and how to do things correctly is essential.

This is a lesson I ignored early on, even though I heard it repeatedly. Especially when you grow a business rapidly, which can happen nowadays with e-commerce and the access we have to social media, financial understanding becomes even more critical.

With TikTok, for example, you could post a video and literally make a million dollars by the end of the month from just one video.

Being prepared financially is non-negotiable. At the very minimum, track your expenses and income. This basic practice will save you from countless headaches down the road.

Surround Yourself with the Right People

The people you surround yourself with are crucial to your success.

A significant part of what I credit to Jelly Wax’s success is the evolution of my values. The values I had when I started Jelly Wax are significantly different from the values I have now.

Knowing your values is an ongoing process, not something that happens overnight. This is especially true if you start young, as I did.

Being self-aware of your strengths and weaknesses is crucial because it helps you recognize what kind of support you need.

Initially, I didn’t choose great people to work with, which hindered my progress. If I had been more selective with the people I trusted, I could have avoided dealing with many problems.

Finding the right people who complement your skills and share your values makes all the difference between struggling alone and building a successful team.

Balance Passion with Practicality

This third lesson might be controversial because you’ll hear conflicting advice. Some people will tell you to check your industry value and market share—analyze all those statistics before starting a business.

While I do think that’s important (the market size for frogs versus waxing products is very different), I believe the most important thing is to follow your passion.

However, you must balance passion with financial numbers to determine whether your idea can be a viable business.

This balance is critical. The reason I emphasize passion is that I’ve found one of the biggest differentiating factors for my companies is me.

With Jelly Wax, we have excellent products, but if I’m not able to talk about them and present them to people authentically, we easily blend in with thousands of other wax brands on the internet.

A huge shift for Jelly Wax came when I focused on being authentic and following my passion. It might sound funny, but I’ve become passionate about body hair.

When I started, I wasn’t passionate about it—I actually hated body hair. But as I grew, I realized how messed up it was that I hated something natural about my body.

I recognized this as a societal issue where young women are made to feel awful for having something completely natural. This realization connected my values with my passion for the business.

Conclusion

You need to have a great product with a good unique selling proposition, but you also need to talk about it in a way that gets people enrolled in your ideas and passions.

The best way to do that is to work on something you already love.

I love business, I love talking about my values, and I love helping people feel comfortable being themselves. These passions infuse every part of our brand now, making Jelly Wax stand out in a crowded market.

By mastering your finances, surrounding yourself with the right people, and balancing passion with practicality, you create a foundation for sustainable business growth that goes beyond just making sales.

These lessons have transformed how I approach business and have been instrumental in rebuilding Jelly Wax into something I’m truly proud of.

After my early ventures like Hannah Must Haves, my business journey took several interesting turns before I eventually found success with Jelly Wax and Project Pollywog.

Table of Contents

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Education Playing a RoleFinding My WayEarly Jobs and the Sales ExperienceThe Moment of DecisionThe Birth of Jelly WaxRapid Growth and Growing PainsProject Pollywog and Finding BalanceConclusion

Education Playing a Role

My educational path significantly shaped my entrepreneurial journey. Being homeschooled until high school gave me tremendous flexibility.

I could finish my lessons for the entire week and then devote the remaining time to my business ventures. When I entered traditional high school, however, my focus temporarily shifted.

I became deeply invested in academics and started considering conventional career paths—becoming a veterinarian, an engineer, or a doctor. Entrepreneurship took a back seat, even though I always knew I’d eventually return to it.

Finding My Way

During high school, I moved to a new school across the state after my sophomore year. The transition proved difficult, and I struggled to adjust.

I found myself spending countless hours at the local airport, where I developed an interest in becoming a pilot. I began taking flying lessons, waking up at 5 AM to fit lessons in before school and returning to the airport afterward.

Although I never quite completed my pilot’s license (I was very close, just needed to take the written test), this experience was pivotal because it was at the airport where I met successful business owners who would influence my path.

One gentleman handed me a stack of books that he insisted I needed to read before even considering going into business—classics like Rich Dad, Poor Dad and Think and Grow Rich.

These books taught me that mindset constitutes about 80% of the battle in business, while execution makes up the remaining 20%.

I also began to realize how I could potentially achieve success in business more quickly than through a traditional career path.

Early Jobs and the Sales Experience

After high school, I worked various jobs while trying to determine what type of business I wanted to start. I worked at In-N-Out for a while, but I felt they weren’t fully recognizing my potential.

When I received a mere 25-cent raise after a mini-promotion, something clicked inside me—I knew I needed to find an opportunity with more growth potential.

I found a commission-only sales job selling resort casino packages. The job required me to be 18, and I was still two months shy of my birthday when I interviewed.

I asked if they would wait for me to turn 18, and they agreed. Once I started, I had to approach 100 people daily and visit at least 30 businesses.

It was incredibly challenging, but I stuck with it for six months, learning valuable skills about handling rejection and developing perseverance.

The Moment of Decision

During my time at the sales job, I had a two-hour commute each way. I used this time to listen to podcasts, particularly Masters of Scale by Reid Hoffman, the founder of LinkedIn.

One episode featured the founder of Spanx, who described having an epiphany while sitting in her car before work, realizing she couldn’t continue her sales job and needed to start her own business.

This resonated deeply with me because I was in exactly the same position—sitting in my car, dreading another day of sales work.

In what I now recognize was a rather impulsive decision, I quit my job, sold my car, and decided to start a business with the $5,000 I had available.

The Birth of Jelly Wax

With no clear idea of what business to start, I locked myself in my room, researched various options, and eventually settled on waxing products. This decision stemmed from my personal struggles with body hair removal.

Growing up, I had internalized the message that women shouldn’t have body hair—it was “unladylike” and “dirty.”

I would even wear a sweatshirt in summer because I was too embarrassed to show my arm hair.

When I discovered waxing, it worked better for me than other methods, but I struggled to find products gentle enough for my sensitive skin.

Shaving gave me ingrown hairs and bumps, and threading wasn’t practical because it was limited to facial hair when I needed hair removed from everywhere. This gap in the market became my business opportunity.

I purchased more than 20 different brands of wax, studied their formulations, and reverse-engineered what I was looking for in an ideal wax. Then I collaborated with formula developers to create our unique blend.

Before I even had all the inventory, I assembled a sample kit of what the final product would theoretically look like and launched pre-orders. I needed to reach minimum order quantities of about 2,500 kits—an incredibly risky move for a new entrepreneur.

For almost a month, sales were slow—I was down to my last $500 in ad spend and had only made a handful of sales. Then, something changed.

I created a video ad that connected with people (possibly aided by the timing with COVID-19 and salons closing down), and within three months, Jelly Wax skyrocketed from zero to about $700,000 in sales.

By the end of the first year, we had gained tremendous growth and momentum.

Rapid Growth and Growing Pains

The rapid success was validating but also created enormous challenges. I had no experience in logistics, finance, or running an operation of that scale. I didn’t even have a bookkeeper or CPA.

I understood running a business in theory, but I had no idea how to physically do it. I made poor investment decisions and stumbled through supply chain and shipping issues.

At one point, I had to move two 40-foot containers of inventory from my warehouse to my house. My family and I ended up fulfilling thousands of orders every month from my living room and garage.

Eventually, neighbors reported me to the HOA for running a business out of my house.

The burnout was inevitable. After two years, despite the financial success, I was completely overwhelmed. I had just two people helping me with customer service, but that was the extent of my team.

I had hired some consultants, but they weren’t a good fit for me. My family had to bail me out of financial difficulties I’d created through my lack of proper bookkeeping.

I ultimately made the difficult decision to pause the business completely. I moved to Austin, Texas, and took nearly two years away from Jelly Wax to recover and rethink my approach.

Project Pollywog and Finding Balance

During my break from Jelly Wax, I launched Project Pollywog—a brand selling frog-themed jewelry with a portion of profits supporting frog conservation efforts.

This was truly a passion project that connected with my love of animals and jewelry design. It took me back to my roots with Hannah Must Haves.

Project Pollywog also grew quickly, reaching six figures within the first six months. While exciting, this created new challenges as I found myself running two businesses simultaneously.

Eventually, I had to make the difficult decision to pause Project Pollywog to focus entirely on rebuilding Jelly Wax.

Conclusion

My journey back to Jelly Wax was significantly influenced by my partner, who saw what I had accomplished and encouraged me to return to it.

He completely changed my perspective and helped me realize how much I needed help. He was stable, calm, and kind, giving me the space I needed to heal and grow.

He encouraged me, saying, “You have to go back into this. You can do this. This is what you’re supposed to do.” His words motivated me as he helped me get my life back in order.

As a professional chef, he told me, “Food is healing,” and cooked meals specifically designed to balance my hormones and improve my physical health. Through healing my body, I was able to heal my mind as well.

After about a year, I felt ready to return to business, but I didn’t have anyone to start it with. I had only been working to pay my bills and manage my debt payments.

My partner took his savings and invested it into me and the company. He became a partner in the business, which blew my mind because we weren’t married or formally tied together in any way.

The fact that he trusted me so much showed me that trusting the right people can be wonderful.

This partnership taught me the value of trusting others—something I had struggled with earlier in my entrepreneurial journey.

One of my first businesses was selling sodas when I was around six years old. I borrowed sodas from my dad’s garage and went door-to-door selling them to my neighbors.

The feeling of providing something people wanted was incredibly validating, and I loved being able to use that money to buy ice cream for all the neighborhood kids.

Even at that young age, I was fascinated by what money could do—not just for me, but for others too.

Middle School Entrepreneur

In middle school, I took my business ambitions to the next level.

Having been part of Girl Scouts when I was younger, I learned to make handmade goods like hair scrunchies and jewelry. These skills became the foundation for my brand, Hannah Must Haves.

Being homeschooled all the way until high school gave me the flexibility to pursue my business interests. After finishing my weekly lessons, I had the entire week to commit to my businesses and explore my passions.

I would work diligently making as many products as possible, with a simple goal: sell three items every weekend. Then on Saturdays, I’d go door-to-door in my neighborhood with my creations.

Jewelry from Hannah Must Haves

Expanding My Reach

As Hannah Must Haves grew, I began attending local art fairs to sell my handmade items.

I even created a blog and YouTube channel where I showcased every single little earring I made with its own dedicated post. Looking back, I was developing marketing skills without even realizing it.

I truly enjoyed the creative process—handling the materials, crafting each piece by hand, and seeing customers appreciate my work.

The business wasn’t just about making money; it was about the joy of creation and connection with my customers.

Growing with Demand

By the time I was about 13, my business evolved in an unexpected direction. Customers on Etsy started asking if I could make stamps—specifically, stamps for stamping handmade soap.

I hadn’t even considered this niche before, but I quickly realized I could design logos and custom stamps for other creators who were selling skincare products.

This pivot taught me an important lesson: listen to customer needs and be willing to adapt your business accordingly.

It also introduced me to serving other business owners rather than just end consumers—something that would influence my future business decisions.

More jewelry from Hannah Must Haves

Family Support

My dad was a significant influence during this time.

He would give me business books and fund my early ventures (even if he didn’t always realize I was “borrowing” his resources at first).

One important lesson he taught me was that to be truly successful in business, you shouldn’t do all the work yourself.

At the time, I resisted this idea. I think it was because I didn’t trust anyone else to do the work as well as I could.

This mindset became a recurring challenge throughout my entrepreneurial journey—one I would have to overcome again and again.

Earrings from Hannah Must Haves

Conclusion

Hannah Must Haves may seem modest compared to my later ventures, but it laid essential groundwork for everything that followed.

The lessons about customer service, product development, marketing, and managing a small operation directly transferred to my future businesses.

Most importantly, Hannah Must Haves taught me that business isn’t just about profit—it’s about providing value, connecting with people, and creating something meaningful.

That philosophy has remained at the core of every business I’ve built since.

The bumps, the razor burn, the itchy stubble—it all drove me insane, especially because I have sensitive skin, so naturally that made everything worse.

I tried waxing because I loved the smooth results, but most waxes either irritated my skin or, worse, took some of it off.

Bumps

It was frustrating, messy, and time consuming to say the least.

I kept searching for something that worked, but nothing fit.

So, I decided to take matters into my own hands.

That’s how Jelly Wax was born—a simple, effective solution for people like me who were fed up with the struggles of daily shaving.

More Than Just Hair

As I connected with more and more of YOU, I realized Jelly Wax was about more than just a hair removal routine.

I started hearing from people who had unique challenges, especially those with PCOS, who were dealing with rapid hair regrowth.

Shaving barely lasted a day for them, and while laser treatments might have been an option for some, it wasn’t always realistic due to skin tone, hair color, or cost.

More Than A Product

For these customers, and for me, Jelly Wax became more than just a product.

It became a symbol of empowerment.

It’s not just about hair removal; it’s about offering a solution that truly works for people who are often overlooked by the beauty industry.

Jelly Wax Ingredients

Our signature formula is made for sensitive skin.

What's in it and why is it so good for sensitive skin?

Our starter kit

Hannah's Note: Our Sensitive Skin Jelly Wax Line includes: Aurora, Arctic, Citrus, Coconut Cream, Caribbean Ice, Orange Citrus, & Lilac Simmer.

Hypoallergenic

Rosin is a common ingredient used in many waxes, and is often the reason for rashes, or red spots on your skin.

Not using rosin helps to reduce the risk of allergic reactions and makes the formula safer and gentler for sensitive skin.

Hannah's Note: Always do a allergy strip test on a small area beforehand.

Microcrystalline Wax

Delivers a smoother application, grips hair firmly for effective removal, and is less prone to breakage, perfect for dense and coarse hair.

Castor Oil

Offers anti-inflammatory and moisturizing properties, soothing the skin post-waxing and reducing irritation, making it highly suitable for sensitive skin.

Rose Essential Oils

Calms both skin and senses with its natural soothing properties and delightful scent, enhancing the waxing experience.

Paraffin

This helps ease the hair removal process by softening the skin and opening pores, softening the follicle and skin, which reduces pain and enhancing comfort for sensitive skin.

Aluminium Hydroxide

Serves as a soothing agent to reduce skin irritation post-waxing, enhancing comfort for users with sensitive skin.

Ethylene VA Copolymer

Increases the wax's elasticity, allowing it to adhere well and remove hair efficiently, especially in areas with uneven growth.

This is wonderful because it helps prevent wax that snaps and cracks.

If you want to remove a lot of hair in one strip, you'll want a flexible wax.

Titanium Dioxide

Minimizes skin irritation during the waxing process, providing a protective barrier that is beneficial for delicate skin.

Mica

Provides a smooth, translucent consistency that makes it way easier to see the hair you're waxing .

This helps ensure a more precise and effective hair removal, helping to capture every hair and enhance the waxing experience.

Polycyclopentadiene

Provides a flexible yet sturdy structure, ideal for tackling coarse hair without breaking, essential for a clean wax that doesn't leave hair behind.

Calcium Aluminum Borosilicate

Used for its light-reflecting properties, helping to achieve a smoother application and minimizing discomfort during wax removal.

Tin Oxide

Helps maintain the wax's texture and consistency, ensuring effective adherence to and removal of hair.

Conclusion

Jelly Wax is more than just an at-home waxing kit.

It’s about redefining beauty standards and helping everyone feel comfortable and confident, whether they choose to remove their hair or let it grow.

We’re here to make the process easy, effective, and empowering for you. Period.

Want to try it out? Click here to get our starter kit.

We discussed Project Pollywog, our mission to save endangered frog species, and our journey as young entrepreneurs making a difference in conservation.

About Breaching Extinction

The Breaching Extinction Podcast explores conservation issues through interviews with people working to make a difference.

While the podcast initially focused on the endangered Southern resident killer whales of the Salish Sea, Erica is now expanding her coverage to include other species facing similar challenges.

The Interview

Erica Wirth, the host of Breaching Extinction, created such a welcoming environment for our conversation. She is genuinely passionate about conservation and asked thoughtful questions that allowed us to share our story in a meaningful way.

Podcast: 101. Hopping into Frog Conservation

Listen to the podcast on Spotify or Apple Podcast.

Erica typically focuses on the Southern resident killer whale population, but she's now branching out to cover other endangered species that need attention - which is how Tay and I ended up as guests on episode #101!

Our Conservation Journey

During the podcast, Tay and I had the chance to share the story behind Project Pollywog - from our early beginnings to our partnership with the Amphibian Foundation.

We discussed our work with endangered frog species like the Georgia gopher frog and California yellow-legged frog, and how our jewelry line directly supports conservation efforts.

We also got to talk about the personal aspects of our journey - including the challenges we've faced as young entrepreneurs trying to make a meaningful impact while staying true to our values.

Behind the Scenes

What you don't see in the podcast is how nervous we were before the interview!

But Erica's friendly approach immediately put us at ease. We spent about an hour chatting about frogs, conservation, entrepreneurship, and our personal stories.

The conversation flowed naturally, and Erica's genuine interest in our work made it feel less like an interview and more like a chat with a friend who shares our passion for protecting endangered species.

Conclusion

Being featured on the Breaching Extinction Podcast was a highlight for both Tay and me.

Erica's genuine approach to conservation journalism made the experience truly special, and we hope our conversation inspires others to find their own way to contribute to conservation efforts.

Thank you, Erica, for the opportunity to share our story! We look forward to continuing this conversation and perhaps even joining you again in the future as our journey with Project Pollywog evolves.

Full Transcript

Erica Wirth: Hello, everybody, and welcome back to the Breaching Extinction podcast. I hope you all had a wonderful week. This week, I have Hannah Van Overbeek and Tay Shoemaker from Project Polliwog here with me. How are you doing today?

Hannah Van Overbeek: Happy to be here.

Erica Wirth: Yes, definitely. Happy to have you here. I'm so excited to learn more about what you're doing. I came across Project Polliwog on social media, and I thought it was such a cool idea. Can you introduce yourselves? Who are you? Where are you from? What do you do? What are your hobbies?

Hannah Van Overbeek: Want to go first?

Tay Shoemaker: Sure. Okay. Yeah. So, my name is Tay Shoemaker. I run a frog rescue since about 2018, and it's kind of the stereotypical rescue, even though it's frogs. So, like a dog rescue? Same thing, but just frogs. I take in injured, sick, or neglected frogs, and we rehabilitate them and then adopt them out to people who are looking to bring a frog into their life and find great forever homes for them. Yeah, so that's me. You might know me from Taz Exotic Critters Rescue or Mother of Frogs on TikTok. And yeah, that's me.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Oh, and you could also mention where you're from, too, if you want to.

Erica Wirth: Yeah. Where are you from?

Tay Shoemaker: Okay. Do you want the long answer?

Erica Wirth: Let's go with the long answer. We've got time.

Tay Shoemaker: So, I am actually Canadian. I moved to the U.S. in 2015, and I have lived in Texas since then. Grew up on an island in the U.S., and then I moved to Austin because my partner goes to college here. Go Longhorns! Yeah, so that's my story.

Erica Wirth: What island did you live on?

Tay Shoemaker: It's called Port Aransas. It's off Corpus Christi, Texas, right on the Gulf Coast. It's actually a barrier island, so a lot of hurricanes and fun stuff.

Erica Wirth: That's awesome. I've visited Port Aransas before, and I actually went to Stephen F. Austin High School, so I'm very familiar with Texas.

Tay Shoemaker: Oh, no way.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Oh, are you from Texas?

Erica Wirth: Kind of. I mostly grew up in Ohio, but I lived with my aunt and uncle in high school, so I grew up visiting them, and then I went to high school there.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Wow, that's so cool.

Erica Wirth: For sure.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Okay. So, my name is Hannah Van Overbeek. I own Project Polliwog. I guess I'm the founder of that. That's what you would call it. I could go on about the sound of Project Polliwog, but yeah. Geez. So, I grew up in California, and I just moved to Austin three months ago. It was a huge change because I barely traveled much out of California. I moved a lot within California, but I'd never been to Texas before, so it was kind of crazy how I ended up here. But Tay lives here, and so it was perfect. We've been friends over Instagram for a really long time, and then I was like, oh, I'm moving to Austin. So, we just connected, and it worked out great. Now Tay is helping me with Project Polliwog, and she's… I feel weird saying she works for Project Polliwog, but you do.

Tay Shoemaker: But, like, I get the paychecks.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Yeah. She helps me with basically everything, and I couldn't do it without her, so it's amazing.

Erica Wirth: Awesome.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Yeah. So, geez, what do I like to do? I really like frogs, of course. I've never owned a frog before, but I have really good childhood memories with frogs. For me, it's more about the impact of helping save frogs, doing something good for the world. Most of my professional life has been in business, so I've started a couple of companies, and they've never really aligned with what I believe in. When I started Project Polliwog, it was something I actually believed in, which was helping the world, not just… I mean, my other companies were helping the world too, I guess, making customers happy. People liked my stuff, and that's cool, but it just wasn't fulfilling to me.

Erica Wirth: Yes.

Hannah Van Overbeek: You know what I mean? It wasn't having an impact on our environment and the animals. As I like to say, the animals we share a world with deserve protection just as much as we do. That was kind of why I segued into looking at what I could help save. What do I really like? Oh, I love frogs. I should start a company around it. I went to school for graphic design, which is kind of different from business, what I ended up in. But I really love designing. I love art. I'm a huge art nerd. With Project Polliwog, I'm able to exercise that by designing all this different jewelry based around the main muse.

Tay Shoemaker: Hannah designs everything, so any graphic you see, it's all Hannah. All the jewelry, she designed it all. It really comes from the heart.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Yeah. The way I describe Project Polliwog is it's literally me in a box.

Erica Wirth: That's amazing. Okay, you guys look really young. I have to ask, how old are you?

Tay Shoemaker: Well, I'm 21, so I'm a 2000s baby, but, you know.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Yeah, I'm 20. I am turning 21 this year. Just putting that out there.

Erica Wirth: The way you guys are talking, I'm like, they have to be in their 30s to have done all these amazing things, but you look so young.

Hannah Van Overbeek: We just started really young, I think.

Erica Wirth: I mean, I actually…

Hannah Van Overbeek: I was homeschooled until high school, so I had a lot of freedom to do what I liked, finish school at my own pace. I would finish really early, and the rest of the day I would spend doing whatever I wanted—reading or other things. When I went to public school in high school, I loved it, absolutely loved it, all the people. But I ended up only staying for two years, then left again because I didn't have time to focus on what I liked to do. I love school, I love learning, but it just wasn't everything for me. I wanted to get more experience. I still feel like I don't know anything.

Tay Shoemaker: I'm the same way. I moved out at 17, started business college, and then found out it wasn't for me. So, I was like, you know what? I'm going to start my own business and do it the way I want. And now we're here, partnered.

Erica Wirth: Amazing. I've heard of people like that. I have a friend who said high school wasn't her vibe. She went off and did study abroad programs instead. Another friend sailed the world with her dad because she felt it was more beneficial and stimulating than being in school.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Yeah. Everything has its benefits. Some people do really well in school, follow that line of going to college, getting a degree, and going into their career, and they need those things. But for me, I'm not in engineering, I'm not going to be a doctor, so it just didn't make sense. But I have respect for people who can do that.

Erica Wirth: Yeah, no, for sure. I totally get you. It's not for everybody. School is so expensive. I have so much student debt. It is what it is. So, now you guys are in Austin together. Is the frog rescue for pet frogs, or do you find frogs? What's the deal with that?

Tay Shoemaker: Either. Typically, when we get wild-caught frogs, it's people who have accidentally injured them or found them in the winter when it's too cold, and they're supposed to be hibernating, but they've been uprooted or are in a place they shouldn't be. We get a lot of that, but I don't really go out and find them. When I first started, there were a couple of injured frogs, and that inspired me. I was like, I love doing this, so maybe I can help other people with their frogs or when they find injured ones. But a lot of it is pets that have been neglected, or parents buy them for their kids and realize it's a big responsibility. There's a lot more to frogs than people think. A lot of the time, people are like, I don't know what to do. I got this for my kid, thought it was like a goldfish that would pass away after a month, even though that's not how it's supposed to be.

Erica Wirth: Amazing. Okay, that's really cool. So, to give our listeners context, if they don't know what Project Polliwog is, it's a little business where you make jewelry for polliwogs. But I don't even know what a polliwog really is. I googled it—obviously, it's a frog. Can you tell us, what are polliwogs? What's going on with them? Because they're not doing well, and you've started your business to help them.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Yeah. Okay, so polliwogs are a general term. It means baby frog. You know how there are different stages of growth for frogs? They start as an egg, then become a tadpole, and then—yeah, tadpole slash polliwog. So, polliwog basically means the same as tadpole; it's just a stage of growth for frogs. I thought Project Polliwog flowed really well, and I was like, that's perfect. But yeah, actually, what we're doing right now is—it's the polliwogs that need help because every frog is a polliwog at some point.

Tay Shoemaker: They all go through it.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Yeah. But there are two specific frogs we're mostly trying to help right now, and we're partnered with the Amphibian Foundation, which I'm not sure if you're familiar with, but they're located in Georgia. They're a research facility and rehabilitation, repopulation, and research center, all geared toward saving endangered amphibians in Georgia. They help save a lot of salamanders and also the Georgia gopher frog, which is the one we're focusing on. They raise and breed the gopher frogs, release them into mesocosms, and slowly introduce them back into the population, creating sustainable habitats for them. It's amazing what they're doing. We help support them financially, and in the future, we're also going to help with volunteer power and ideally expand to different areas of the United States to save more species of frogs. Right now, the main goal is to help get them off the endangered species list because they're number three among the most endangered amphibians in Georgia, which is crazy. They recently hatched either 600 or 700 gopher frogs, and we were super excited to be part of that program. A portion of all orders goes toward helping save them.

Tay Shoemaker: We also work with the California yellow-legged frog, so we're supporting efforts on both coasts, both sides of the U.S., but the idea is to branch out.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Yeah, we want to, but if we take on all the frogs, it's really hard to actually help them because it costs so much money to breed these frogs and put them in habitats. Another thing we've learned is that the endangered species list is very political. Even if the frogs are saved or fine now, they won't remove them, or there's a lot of red tape. That's another path we're looking to move forward with, being part of social reform to actually help these frogs and eventually all amphibians. That's where we're moving toward. We started with two because we can handle two—barely. But if we allocate resources specifically, there's a better chance of success.

Erica Wirth: For sure. I think that's really smart. A lot of businesses greenwash, saying they're helping, but it sounds like you guys are actually taking reasonable steps to have an impact. That's huge.

Hannah Van Overbeek: It's about actually making an impact because otherwise, what's the point? It doesn't mean anything.

Tay Shoemaker: Yeah.

Erica Wirth: I totally feel you. Unfortunately, there are a lot of businesses like that, but we're starting to see more doing good. There's this idea that businesses are inherently greedy or can't help, but we live in a capitalistic society. You need to pay your rent. It's a balance. This seems like a really good balance. How many of each type of frog are there currently, and what is endangering both of them?

Hannah Van Overbeek: Okay, I'll talk mostly about the Georgia gopher frog and the California yellow-legged frog because those are the ones I know most about right now. The Georgia gopher frog is mainly suffering from loss of habitat and fire suppression, which I'm sure you're familiar with. It's really sad. Gopher frogs need open-canopy ponds with wiregrass, and these habitats are disappearing. They're also disrupted when fires are suppressed because of that whole cycle with the chemicals they use. It disrupts the ecosystem.

Tay Shoemaker: If anyone isn't aware of fire suppression or why wildfires are actually a good thing—not for us people, obviously, but for ecosystems—when those natural fires happen, they're burning everything, and new life gets to come up. It helps a lot with the animals. Of course, it doesn't help us, but fires are important for ecosystems, and fire suppression doesn't allow for that complete restart. There's a lot of dying plants, or they're not growing as well, removing nutrients and good things ecosystems need.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Exactly. One thing I was thinking about is combating the need for fire suppressants by updating building codes and city regulations on what materials are allowed for houses. If houses are resistant to fires, there's less need to stop these natural fires.

Tay Shoemaker: Or building in places we know are prone to fires.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Yeah, that too.

Tay Shoemaker: Just an idea.

Hannah Van Overbeek: The yellow-legged frogs are mostly going extinct because of introduced predators, like trout, and the spread of diseases, possibly caused by exposure to pesticides. We're still studying that, so don't quote me on it, but diseases are definitely there. Also, habitat alterations—drought, fire, livestock grazing—all those things. Those are the main things affecting those frogs.

Erica Wirth: Yeah.

Tay Shoemaker: In terms of diseases, the biggest one we're seeing worldwide, but a lot in the U.S. right now, is the chytrid fungus—chytrid, citrid, whatever you want to call it. I call it chytrid. It's a very deadly fungus that takes out hundreds of frogs within a couple of days and is hard to get rid of, especially with global warming, where rising temperatures make it easier for the fungus to grow and spread. It has taken out thousands, hundreds of thousands of frogs, and I believe over 200 species since the 1990s. It's pretty bad, and that's on top of the environmental issues.

Erica Wirth: Wow. Okay, so they've got a lot against them. How many in each population are left?

Hannah Van Overbeek: There's a statistic that one-third of the world's amphibians are going extinct, but I don't want to say you should quote me on that because I'm not sure exactly. Do you know the statistic?

Tay Shoemaker: As of, I believe, 200 species have gone extinct since the 1990s due to chytrid, but an additional 200 have gone extinct since the 1970s because of viruses, fungi, environmental impact, deforestation, pollution, all of that. Specifically for the Georgia gopher frog, I believe they're doing better now with the Amphibian Foundation's help. I'm not sure about the California yellow-legged frog, but I know the gopher frog is getting help. I looked on the Amphibian Foundation website, and they said there are about 300 in the wild now, plus tadpoles and froglets in their research facility. Hopefully, those numbers will continue to rise.

Hannah Van Overbeek: That's a huge part of the plan to help them. I was shocked, but they can't keep the frogs together once they get to a certain age because they'll start eating each other, which makes sense. They have to individually separate each one into its own container—600 or 700 different containers needing to be kept. That takes a huge amount of resources, facilities, time, and volunteer hours. If we can replicate and expand that system, they can breed and release more frogs quicker to repopulate.

Erica Wirth: Wow, that's really cool. What's the general time frame for how long it takes these frogs to get from polliwog stage to big enough to be released?

Hannah Van Overbeek: Mark was saying about a year.

Tay Shoemaker: Yeah, about a year. Frogs typically, depending on the species, reach sexual maturity at about seven to nine months. Then they continue growing, eating a lot to be healthy so they can find a healthy mate and have healthy babies. Tadpole takes a couple of months, then froglet takes about three to four months. They still have their tail but have arms and legs, starting to look like a frog. Then there's juvenile, where the tail is gone, which takes about five to six months. By the time they're sexually mature at seven to nine months, they're pretty much ready to go out into the wild, repopulate, have babies, and live their best life.

Erica Wirth: Okay, amazing. What kind of funding is needed to make this happen? It sounds like a lot of manpower and maybe not Tupperware, but nice tanks or something. Do you know the average cost for a year of breeding and releasing them into the wild?

Hannah Van Overbeek: That's a really good question. I asked Mark—Mark Mandica, M-A-N-D-I-C-A. Sorry, Mark.

Tay Shoemaker: Yeah, sorry, Mark.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Mark is the executive director of the Amphibian Foundation. He knows a lot about everything they're doing and directs it all. I asked him that question a couple of weeks ago because we were trying to figure out how much it costs to save one frog, so we could figure out how much money we need to raise and donate. We don't have an exact number yet, but he mentioned they use cow tubs—like cow drinking troughs, those big circular plastic bins that sit out in the sun and won't deteriorate. They use those to create mini mesocosms to breed the frogs. Those alone run a couple thousand dollars. I don't want to put a number on it because I don't have one, but it's definitely worth it.

Tay Shoemaker: I’d say probably in the hundreds of thousands to operate full-time every year. It’s expensive—you have to pay researchers, keep facilities up, pay rent. A lot goes into it.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Mark mentioned that a lot of them, like him, aren’t even on payroll because it’s mostly volunteers, which is amazing but also makes me sad. They work so hard for these animals, and yet nobody really knows about them. They have a good following, but there are 8 billion people in the world—everybody, show up!

Erica Wirth: I totally feel you. Even if someone has 100,000 followers on a platform, that’s not even 1% of the world. You don’t need the entire world to show up for every cause, but you’re like, come on. The people doing the real work often go unrecognized, while others get attention for doing nothing. It’s frustrating.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Exactly.

Erica Wirth: Pollywog just turned a year old yesterday, right? So, happy one-year anniversary!

Hannah Van Overbeek: Yeah, thank you! It’s been amazing what we’ve been able to help with, but we have huge plans for the future. Right now, we have three people on our team, but by the end of the year, we’re hoping to have a lot more. We’re working on pitch decks, and now we have the background and results to show a proven model and a powerful mission. We’re ready to expand. We’ve been putting together pitch decks and figuring out how to approach VCs—venture capitalists—because I don’t know anything about that. Thankfully, our CFO does. By next year, we hope to have a really big impact and help these frogs in a big way.

Erica Wirth: That’s amazing. You guys sound like you’ve got it together. I love that you’re making sure you have a working model. In conservation, we often see people with good intentions doing unhelpful things or even harming animals because they think they’re doing the right thing. It’s great to see you doing the research.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Yeah, exactly. We did a lot of research when looking for foundations to partner with. We didn’t partner with the Amphibian Foundation until mid-last year, very recently. We were just funding and donating before that. It was really important to me—and now to us—that we make a difference, the right difference, not something terrible. The Amphibian Foundation is amazing, and we’re so lucky to be partnered with them.

Erica Wirth: That’s such an important point. We all want to do what we love and pay our bills, but sometimes in the day-to-day cycle, you don’t think about losing your soul to something. It’s so easy in this world. I feel you on not wanting to be negative, but it’s a real reality. I’d love to hear more about how you reset, because so many people in conservation and science struggle with getting sucked into that. How did you rebound? You’re vibrant, positive, and ready to make a change. What can we do to get some of that energy?

Hannah Van Overbeek: Thanks. One of my more successful companies was a waxing company selling biodegradable hair removal waxing kits. It was good, but running it with minimal help was stressful. I lost sight of people. When I got help, I wasn’t interacting with customers anymore, just in my own box, not painting or doing art—things I loved. I was focused on numbers, emails, like Wolf of Wall Street. When you’re scaling, you lose sight of people. They didn’t feel like people anymore; it was all about money. I wanted to pay rent, but it didn’t fulfill me.

Tay Shoemaker: You weren’t happy.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Yeah, I wasn’t happy. I got really depressed and experienced severe burnout for a couple of months. I couldn’t get out of bed. There were other factors too—some crappy people took advantage of my success because I was young. At 18, I didn’t realize it, and when I did, it made me feel like I couldn’t trust anyone. I was forced into a reset. I moved out at 18, worked for a year, focused on business, then went back home after the depression to reconnect with my family. I spent time with my little sister, not thinking about myself or what I wanted to achieve. My whole life, I’d been focused on what I wanted to do, thinking I’d spend time with family once I was successful. After a year of pausing business to heal and reconnect with humanity, it changed my perspective. That’s when I started Polliwog, near the end, because I wanted something fulfilling that made a difference. It was a long process of being a crappy person, but with Polliwog, I stayed involved in every aspect—customer service, everything—so I’d never lose that touch again.

Erica Wirth: I’m impressed and inspired by your vulnerability and authenticity. That’s a real thing many people go through—burnout, soul-sucking situations. It’s remarkable that at 20, you figured it out. People in their 50s don’t always do that. Our parents’ generation was more about making money, screw your passions, just buy a house. But buying a house is unrealistic for most of us now, so we’re like, screw it. It’s amazing you figured it out so young. The world is hard, and I don’t see you as negative or having a victim mentality. Some people suck and take advantage. You’re both bright, sparkly people with a lot to offer, and some want to take that. I’m glad you have each other to share the sparkle and build each other up. A lot of people experience this but don’t stop to question it because we’re told to work, make money, and that’s supposed to fulfill us. But it doesn’t. The happiest people have enough and healthy relationships—we’re social creatures.

Hannah Van Overbeek: You nailed it. That’s so beautifully said. I couldn’t agree more. For anyone experiencing burnout, one tidbit: it’s hard to shift from that mentality when you’ve been working or studying so long, going through the motions. Sometimes it feels like life is controlling you. One way I moved toward being happier and more fulfilled was focusing on what I love. If you don’t know what that is, try things. We want instant gratification, but it’s a bunch of tiny things done consistently that make a happy life. When I was trying to get out of burnout, I tried painting again and didn’t enjoy it at first. I was like, why am I not enjoying this? But I kept doing it, and over two or three months, I started to enjoy it again. One day, I was like, I want to do this again. That was a big realization—you don’t have to love it right away; keep doing it, and the love grows.

Erica Wirth: That’s such a good way to put it—keep doing it, and the love grows. It’s easy for things you love to become a chore, especially with money attached. That’s the world we live in—we can’t work for free; rent is due, groceries need buying. So, you said toward the end of this journey, you started Project Polliwog. Tell us, what is Project Polliwog?

Hannah Van Overbeek: Project Polliwog is a frog jewelry line. All our jewelry is frog-based. Two of my favorites are the California yellow-legged frog necklace and the Georgia gopher frog necklace. I design all the jewelry. We have a bunch of necklaces—most of our line is necklaces. We’re working on a birthstone collection right now, and I’m really excited for it. It’s going to be awesome. Right now, our jewelry is stainless steel-based, 14-karat gold-plated. We’re thinking of starting a fine jewelry line with the same designs in solid gold, so people can use it as heirlooms and pass it down, which will help support the frogs more than our main jewelry.

Tay Shoemaker: But our main jewelry is really good and pretty.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Yeah, it’s awesome.

Tay Shoemaker: I’ve had my necklace since last year, and it’s still perfect. I wear it every day. They don’t tarnish easily and aren’t gaudy. A lot of frog jewelry is big, chunky, and tacky, designed for kids. My family gives me frog stuff because I like frogs, and a lot of it is ugly jewelry. I wear it because I love them, but our jewelry is very pretty and dainty.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Exactly. Anything I design is something I’d wear. I don’t design anything I wouldn’t wear—not yet, anyway, because not everyone’s me. But for now, it works. I love small, dainty jewelry, not huge, bulky stuff. Everything is smaller than half an inch.

Tay Shoemaker: Even the bigger stuff isn’t too heavy.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Yeah, if turned into earrings, they wouldn’t drag your ears down.

Erica Wirth: I saw your stuff and noticed that. As a whale lover, people give me everything whale-related, and some looks stupid. I appreciate it, but not everything you want to wear. Your stuff is cute, not clunky, with nice gold colors. It doesn’t look like it came from Claire’s.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Exactly. It looks like something an adult or kid could wear—versatile. I love designing with stacking in mind because I love stacking with other dainty gold chains. They’re adjustable, so you can wear them choker-style or lower.

Tay Shoemaker: Cute.

Erica Wirth: I love it. What’s your timeline for birthstones and fine jewelry?

Hannah Van Overbeek: We work with a jewelry manufacturer named Alan. He’s amazing—him and his team do everything by hand, paint everything by hand.

Erica Wirth: That’s awesome.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Yeah, it’s gorgeous. I love working with them. We just put in the order for the birthstone collection. I have the prototypes, and I love them. They’re going to be really pretty and will launch our fine jewelry line, as they’ll be the first piece—birthstone necklaces. We’re planning a whole experience with boxes, customized notes, and fancy stuff. We’re hoping to roll those out by early June.

Erica Wirth: I’m looking forward to it. I need to buy a necklace from you guys. I was wondering if you made the jewelry yourself. It makes sense that you have someone helping.

Hannah Van Overbeek: When you’re doing things at scale, it’s impossible to do it yourself. The people we work with hand-make everything, but we want to get everyone a necklace in a decent amount of time. Our shipping times are fast. We ship everything ourselves out of my apartment.

Tay Shoemaker: We can’t be sitting there painting eyes on every necklace.

Hannah Van Overbeek: It would take at least two hours to make one necklace. We love the idea, but we want to be big enough to make a huge change.

Erica Wirth: Absolutely. It looks homemade and crafty, but I wasn’t sure if it was you or someone else. You have a well-thought-out plan to offer a quality product and make a change. You’re very inspiring, especially for your age. It’s incredible that you’ve started several businesses and a frog rescue. I’m proud of and inspired by you both. Thanks for sharing your insight and talking about what you’re up to. I look forward to seeing what you do in the future. Any final thoughts for our listeners?

Hannah Van Overbeek: You go first.

Tay Shoemaker: I want to touch on the fact that we’re so young. Some people see these stories and feel bad about themselves because they’re not in the same place. Hannah and I got an early start, so don’t feel bad. It took me three years of rescuing to even say I’m an official rescue. We still struggle financially, struggle to pay rent sometimes. I do a lot of social media, so I deal with burnout constantly. We’re real people, just like you. Don’t be hard on yourself—you can do anything at any age.

Hannah Van Overbeek: I’m going to bounce off that. Follow your passion—it’s said a lot, but in our day and age, you can do something big with it. It’s not easy—literally not easy. I don’t want to make it sound like we’re doing amazing. We’re trying to keep true to our values, help save these frogs, and sometimes we struggle a lot. That’s part of the process. Enjoy the process. One of my favorite quotes, by John Lennon, is, “Life is what happens while you’re busy making plans.” I keep that in mind when I’m stressed or having a bad day—it’s a good thing. When good days come, I can enjoy them because life is a roller coaster. There are good and bad days, and that’s how it works.

Erica Wirth: That’s very insightful, especially for young people who don’t yet have the tools to stop comparing themselves to others. Everyone’s insecure, especially when young, feeling like they need to do more. I love how authentic and vulnerable you are. Struggling to pay rent is real—1 in 4 Americans is food insecure, but nobody talks about it because we’re taught it’s embarrassing. It’s a reality, especially post-pandemic, with inflation. My usual question is, what can we learn from the whales? But I want to know, what can we learn from the polliwogs?

Tay Shoemaker: I think learning to adapt. Frogs go through many life forms—from a little polliwog that can’t get out of the water, just swimming and eating, to a bigger animal that hunts and deals with invisible factors like pollution. Seeing how they adapt and affect our planet is super important. Everyone can look at a frog and say, if they can keep going, I can too.

Hannah Van Overbeek: You’re totally right. Frogs are an indicator species, so their health shows how our planet is doing, which is amazing. We need them. I’ll hop off what you said and frame it differently. We can learn that it takes time, and we don’t need to rush. Frogs go from blobby eggs to water butterflies, changing completely. Every stage of their life looks different, and that’s okay. Always changing, always growing—that’s what I think.

Erica Wirth: That’s beautiful, and I love that. Thank you again for being on the podcast. I’ll tag all the places on social media where people can find you. Go buy a frog necklace—plugging that right here. Thanks for all the work you’re doing and keep it up. You’re truly amazing.

Tay Shoemaker: Thank you. Thanks for having us.

Hannah Van Overbeek: Thank you so much for having us. This was such a pleasure. We were so honored to see your email. Thank you.

Erica Wirth: I’m honored to have you here. Alrighty, enjoy the rest of your week! Bye.